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#MooreandMe: On Progressives, Rape Apologism, and the Little Guy

So, here are some cheerful statistics for you: According to RAINN, about 60% of rapes aren’t reported. In those cases, there’s about a 51% chance that the 40% of reported rapes will have an arrest made. There’s an 80% chance of prosecution. And, given various factors including conviction and sentencing, there’s only about a 16.3% chance that someone who commits rape will serve time for that rape. Meaning: If we factor in the rapes that go unreported, only 6% of rapists ever serve time. EVER.

Gee, it sounds like making sure that rape accusations are taken seriously, and pursued to the full extent of the law, in all cases, is a pretty important issue, for progressives!

Meanwhile, here are some facts: A man has been accused of rape by two separate women. He fled the country in which he was accused. He is fighting extradition, so that he won’t have to go back to that country and face charges — even though there are spectacularly low rates of conviction for accused rapists, he just doesn’t think that he should have to go through the system, for whatever reason. And you know who’s posting bail for him?

Fucking progressives. That’s who. Including one man who has, for some years now, served as one of the most prominent and recognizable faces of the American left, filmmaker/rabble-rouser/all-around champion of the Truth and the Little Guy, Michael Moore. He’s put $20,000 hard, cashy dollars on the line, so that Julian Assange, white male left-wing darling, will be able to get out on bail despite posing a substantial and acknowledged flight risk, and despite the fact that he evidently is working to avoid facing the charges of his accusers. And why is that? Well, as per Michael Moore’s lengthy diatribe on the subject, which contains exactly one paragraph about the rape charges, his reasoning is as follows:

For those of you who think it’s wrong to support Julian Assange because of the sexual assault allegations he’s being held for, all I ask is that you not be naive about how the government works when it decides to go after its prey. Please — never, ever believe the “official story.” And regardless of Assange’s guilt or innocence (see the strange nature of the allegations here), this man has the right to have bail posted and to defend himself.

In other words: Never, ever believe the women who are accusing Assange of rape. Never, ever believe the allegations that he forcibly held a woman down and raped her, never, ever believe that he raped a woman while she was unconscious. “Regardless of his guilt or innocence” — and it’s clear that Moore has chosen to believe in his “innocence,” despite the fact that Assange’s working to avoid being tried for the crime — help him. Don’t believe anything you hear about the charges, don’t believe the official story, despite the fact that Assange’s people have been caught lying — it turns out there is no such crime as “sex by surprise” in Sweden as Assange’s lawyer Mark Stephens alleged, it is not worth a fine of $715 because it doesn’t exist, and there is also no Swedish law against having sex with a broken condom; what is against the law in Sweden, it turns out, is rape, which is what Assange has been charged with — and a reasonable person might assume that they are the ones it’s unsafe to believe. Don’t believe them. The allegations are “strange.” (They sure did seem that way, when they were being inaccurately reported all over the place, thanks in part to misinformation spread by Assange’s defense.) Believe Michael Moore.

Believe Michael Moore when he tells you that giving $20,000 in bail is fair, because WikiLeaks is important, because the government keeps secrets, and for a lot of people, “secrets killed them.”

Sorry, but you brought this upon yourself. No one can hide from the truth now. No one can plot the next Big Lie if they know that they might be exposed.

Says Michael Moore. But hey, Michael, you know what exposes a Big Lie, a lot of the time? Rape allegations. You know who knows all about big lies? Women who have been raped. Raped, sometimes, by powerful men within our communities; raped by men who were beloved and supported by those communities; raped by our fellow progressives. And we didn’t report, because we knew no-one would believe us; because we knew we’d be shamed and smeared and lied about and harassed until we agreed to go away and let the Big Lie continue to exist. You want to employ the phrase “secrets killed them?” Women who have been raped know all about how secrets can kill people. And how, often, it’s telling the secret that gets you killed. Ask the women who are pressing these charges — their names have been so widely leaked, in one case by your fellow “progressive” media dudebro, Keith Olbermann, that it is possible to find their home addresses, their personal blogs and social media accounts, and to track their activities and personal lives. I’d imagine that they are very much in fear for their lives, due in large part to people like you, Michael Moore, who are insisting that they should not be believed.

And you’re the face of the Left. You have the platform, you have the power, you have the cash and the fame and the name and face recognition: You claim to speak for us. And when you speak, you don’t stand against rape.

So, who remembers the climactic scene of Roger and Me? Everybody, right? Poor little guy Michael Moore, standing up against The Man, standing outside the office of The Man, in fact, just because Roger has done something that has immeasurably harmed his community, and he wants to talk to the guy. He wants to hold him accountable. He wants Roger to look him in the face and tell him why he’s hurt all of these people.

You know what immeasurably harms the progressive community, though, is rape and rape apologism. Is victim-blaming; is accuser-smearing; is the unwillingness of men in positions of power to consider rape a crucial issue that must be taken seriously. And the person who’s hurting our community, and refusing to take responsibility for that, right now, is Michael Moore.

So thank God he’s on Twitter. He is @MMFlint, in fact! And here’s what we’re going to do: We’re going to use the #Mooreandme hashtag to tell him why what he has done and said is wrong. We’re going to talk to the man. We’re going to stand outside his window with a megaphone until he comes down and talks to us. And what we’re going to say — what I hope you’re going to say — is this:

We are the progressive community. We are the left wing. We are women and men, we are from every sector of this community, and we believe that every rape accusation must be taken seriously, regardless of the accused rapist’s connections, power, influence, status, fame, or politics. We believe that rape is a crucial and central issue which affects us all, women disproportionately, and we are sick of being told that you should “never, ever believe” us. We believe that accuser-shaming, accuser-harassment, victim-blaming, and the suppression of rape cases all serve one distinct purpose, which is: TO MAKE IT EASIER FOR PEOPLE TO RAPE US AND GET AWAY WITH IT. To make us scared to report our rapes, even to the people we know. And we will not stand for it any more. We require — not ask, not prefer, absolutely require – progressive media and public figures to stand against rape in every case. Again, this is not negotiable. This is mandatory. This is a requirement: If you don’t stand against rape, and make that stand a crucial and central part of your platform, we do not accept you either as a real “progressive” or as someone who is in any way qualified for authority or a leadership position. We will not buy your merchandise; we will not support you; we will speak out against you. Because a progressive movement that doesn’t stand against rape isn’t a progressive movement. It’s just The Man, it’s just the oppressor, it’s just oppression, in a baseball hat, holding a camcorder.

Please tweet @MMFlint, using the hashtag #Mooreandme, until we have an explanation from Michael Moore, and preferably an apology, and preferably $20,000, donated to an anti-sexual-assault organization of his choice.

You told us the little guy had to stand up, Mr. Moore. You told us the authority had to be held accountable for harming communities. You told us that the Big Lies were worth exposing. But you’re promoting the Big Lie, you’re harming our community, and this time around, the little guy is us.

We can be loud. We can be persistent. I hope you’re prepared.


  1. emjaybee wrote:

    Will keep retweeting, Sady.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 1:19 pm | Permalink
  2. Rocking post, Sady.

    Btw, Moore doubled down on Olbermann’s show last night. Watching the two of them snort about what “hooey” the allegations are is absolutely rage-making.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 1:29 pm | Permalink
  3. Lucy wrote:

    “The way this is being prosecuted is obviously informed by politics. The charges are real and should be taken seriously.”
    See how I did that, Mr. Moore? See how it’s totally possible to say those two things and have them both be right?

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 1:35 pm | Permalink
  4. B. wrote:

    Yeah, uh, wow. Fuck you, Michael Moore.

    This is an outstanding post and a great idea.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 1:36 pm | Permalink
  5. bluebears wrote:

    YES. Thank you for writing this.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 1:37 pm | Permalink
  6. The frustrating thing about this (aside from the fact that real women may have been raped) is that this will be used as a talking point for rape accusations against powerful men for years to come.

    “How can you believe that Senator [X] sexually assaulted one of his interns? Don’t you think it’s a little convenient that these accusations are surfacing now, on the eve of the passage of [Important Bill Z]? Don’t you remember what happened to Julian Assange?”

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 1:43 pm | Permalink
  7. ozymandias wrote:

    Fuck yeah, Sady!

    Since I don’t have Twitter, I intend on writing Mr. Moore a letter explaining how much I love his work and am ashamed of his actions.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 1:47 pm | Permalink
  8. jr wrote:

    brilliant post!

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 1:48 pm | Permalink
  9. RMJ wrote:

    I am very glad this excellent post was written. I was spitting bile for about an hour after I read that dreadful paragraph.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 1:50 pm | Permalink
  10. Crito wrote:

    Shared. Lucy said exactly what I wanted to say but more succinctly than I was going to.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 1:55 pm | Permalink
  11. Katie wrote:

    I’ve decided to stop giving a shit about the “Little Guys” when Moore, et al, start giving a shit about the “Little Women.”

    Thanks for writing this. And thanks for the inspiration.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 1:59 pm | Permalink
  12. Katie wrote:

    Ugh. Typing fail. Not “when,” but “UNTIL!” Gaaaah.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 2:00 pm | Permalink
  13. jess wrote:

    Bravo. Take it to the “oppressor in a baseball hat.”

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 2:19 pm | Permalink
  14. Karen wrote:

    I am all about this!
    My tweet:@MMFlint Political aggression in prosecution does not turn rape into consensual sex or rape charges into “hooey” #mooreandme

    Glad to participate in something so necessary and awesome. I would love to hear his defense of his actions and whatever lame rationalization of the this apparent love for left-leaning white boys with power being confused or purposefully conflated with standing up for the “little guy”. And by love, I mean briefly amused by, followed by majorly depressed by.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 2:20 pm | Permalink
  15. iris wrote:

    thanks sady.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 2:22 pm | Permalink
  16. Mark O. wrote:

    One of your best posts, Sady. Thank you for this!

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 2:23 pm | Permalink
  17. Edmund Metheny wrote:

    Conflating wikileaks and rape charges, as the media has been consistently doing, serves the purposes of neither cause.

    For the record I support wikileaks activities. I also support Assange being returned to Sweden for questioning. If he is guilty of rape, I hope he is punished to the fullest extent of the law.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 2:27 pm | Permalink
  18. ceb wrote:

    Done. Great post.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 2:31 pm | Permalink
  19. Jerks like these make calling myself “progressive” or even “Democrat” anymore a total impossibility. My FDR-worshiping grandmother is spinning in her grave, the poor dear.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 2:33 pm | Permalink
  20. Matt wrote:

    It seems possible that the phrase “official story” as used by Moore was meant to refer to the “story” of the authoritarian-government hell-bent-on-preserving-power and not of the accuser. But then, I’m armchair-psychologizing Moore…

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 2:37 pm | Permalink
  21. Sady wrote:

    @Matt: His statements are still aimed at discrediting these accusers, and he’s openly stated that he believes the charges to be “hooey.” Are you joining, or balking? Because there’s room for you if you join. The whole rest of the Internet for you to comment on if you’re not on board.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 2:45 pm | Permalink
  22. Samantha wrote:

    This is a very good critique, and Moore’s comments and actions are clearly fucked up, but I think you should really re-read the bid where he says “never ever believe the official story”— he is not saying women should not be believed, he is instead positing a conspiracy theory that the women are victims not of Assange but of Assange’s enemies, as pawns in a political game. Now, if he’s wrong— and he probably is— than his actions still add up to these rape victims getting ignored… but he really didn’t say to “never ever believe” women who bring up rape allegations, and by saying he did when he clearly didn’t, you weaken what could be a very strong argument.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 2:45 pm | Permalink
  23. dan solomon wrote:

    @Matt: Yeah, that’s my interpretation of what he meant, too. The implication of it, though, is that the woman accusing Assange are tools of that authoritarian-blah-blah-blah and thus aren’t even a factor in his decision to post bail. Before he went on Olbermann, he wasn’t necessarily calling the women liars, just totally inconsequential. After Olbermann, it’s both.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:01 pm | Permalink
  24. Michelle wrote:

    Do you have a link to an accurate story on the rape case? The one I read the other day completely painted Assange in an “unjustly accused” light. It was very convincing, actually, so I’d like to see info that is unbiased and accurate—well, if that’s still possible.

    I agree that rape is never excusable and he needs to face these charges. I’m just curious to see how much the case has been twisted—by either/both sides.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:18 pm | Permalink
  25. It’s pissing me off big-time that even the more “truthy” and less tabloidical reports on this case ALL mention Miss A’s “guide on how to get revenge on cheating boyfriends that she wrote her own self and is totally about cheating boyfriends,” yet, considering it is a BLOG POST, nobody sees fit to fucking LINK TO IT, no matter how disrespectful they are towards the women’s privacy otherwise. We can publish their home addresses and photographs, but we cannot actually link to the thing on the Internet that she wrote that proves she is evil!

    And, fucking OBVIOUSLY, this is because said guide DOES NOT EXIST. I went and BACKREAD TWO YEARS OF MISS A’S BLOG and it is NOT THERE. What is there is a link to an English-language article on revenge, generally, written from a rather philosophical point of view, and talking about how, like, you should seek revenge against a specific action of the person and not the person in general, and that the revenge you seek should fit the person’s offense or it will not be cathartic, and stuff. There is something about cheating partners that is used as an *example* (The link is to the article; I’m not going to link to Miss A’s blog, but Jessica Valenti did if you don’t believe me that that’s the damn article). Through awkward Google translate (as I do not read Swedish, I admit) got the notion that she was, for some reason or other, having philosophical thoughts about the nature of revenge or some shit like that. Not that she was a particularly vengeful person trying to figure out ways to fuck with people.

    But of course, that’s not as exciting as how awful the things that random dudebros on the Internet JUST TOTALLY KNOW she wrote without even seeing them are.

    …And quite frankly, if the lady had written an article on how to fuck with your sorry-ass cheater of a boyfriend, then as long as “file false rape accusations against him; it will TOTALLY WORK” wasn’t specifically on it, then SO FUCKING WHAT.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:21 pm | Permalink
  26. Eileen wrote:

    I sent my first tweets today, because of you and this campaign. Rape is a progressive issue. If Moore is unconcerned about rape, or feels it is an issue of less importance than the Wikileaks, or if he feels that some good deeds give people rape freebies, then he is not an ally.

    All I would have wanted is for him to reserve judgment until the case has been tried. He couldn’t manage that? He should be ashamed of himself.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:26 pm | Permalink
  27. Ennu wrote:

    I caught Moore on Olbermann last night. Olbermann’s hypocrisy and opportunism are just astonishing. I remember when he was all angry faced that Bill O’Reilly slut-shamed a young girl who was raped and got on his soap-box and played Progressive Man Who is Angered by the Way Women are Treated…and then this happened. Then some dude on his team didn’t just victim blame, but may have raped two women and he could not be quicker to tear them down. I cannot believe this is the standard for “Progressive Media.” It’s painful.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:30 pm | Permalink
  28. Craig Ranapia wrote:

    @Melissa McEwan:

    Yeah, Moore and Olbremann. Don’t you love the smell of wealthy while male privilege; it’s remarkably similar to hot, fresh bullshit.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:31 pm | Permalink
  29. Spatula wrote:

    This rape apologist bullshit makes me sick. Thanks for challenging it, Sady.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:33 pm | Permalink
  30. Simon C. wrote:

    I’ve been following along on Twitter, and holy crap, Sady, you’re a goddamn force of nature. Amazing and inspiring.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:35 pm | Permalink
  31. XtinaS wrote:

    Tweeted, hells yes.  This post is rockstar.


    Should Michael Moore help post bail for WikiLeaks founder, Julian Assange? [poll]

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:35 pm | Permalink
  32. canomia wrote:

    Ok so this made me go get myself a twitter account. Now will someone explain what a hashtag is and how I go about doing this?

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:41 pm | Permalink
  33. Neil wrote:

    It’s great to stick up for women and support rape allegations being taken seriously. I also hate that some Wikileaks supporters are using this as an excuse to wax misogynistic.

    But I think it’s also important to always make it clear that the legality, morality, and significance of Wikileaks is completely unrelated to Assange’s guilt. We can all agree that scandalous celebrity trials receive undue attention over much, much more important stories.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:46 pm | Permalink
  34. Sarahbeth wrote:

    My tweet:
    @MMFlint All rape accusations should be taken seriously, regardless of who they are being made against. #Mooreandme

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:47 pm | Permalink
  35. NomadiCat wrote:


    Hashtags (#) are ways for Twitter to track “trending topics” to see what people are talking about. Great way to mine/ track/ search for data, to show your solidarity for a cause, etc.

    Also, an excellent way of denoting sarcasm, irony, or an aside.

    To denote that you’re talking about a particular Twitter user like Michael Moore (who tweets as MMFlint), put an (@) symbol in front of their username. Like the hashtag, it can then be tracked to see who is talking to or about who.

    Welcome to the wild world of Twitter!

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:48 pm | Permalink
  36. Thefremen wrote:

    Thank you thank you thank you Sady! keep on RTing.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 3:55 pm | Permalink
  37. Some Guy wrote:

    Here’s a tweet that clocks in at exactly 140 characters and packs in a lot, IMO:

    @MMFlint @KeithOlbermann Shaming accusers, suppressing rape cases ALLOWS PEOPLE TO RAPE AND GET AWAY WITH IT. #Mooreandme

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:05 pm | Permalink
  38. canomia wrote:


    Thank you so much. I’m part of it now.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:07 pm | Permalink
  39. ginmar wrote:

    Just goes to show that when people talk about rape what they’re really talking about is what they think about women. MM thinks women lie about rape.

    Progressive men seem to think that if they do a bare minimum of not-being-a-total-asshole stuff then they get cookies, blowjobs, and….rapes. The contempt some lefty men have shown for these women and their accusations has been breathtaking. They obviously think that if you vote for abortion you’ve earned a few ‘get-out-of-feminism’ careds.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:08 pm | Permalink
  40. Here’s my tweet. I tried to jam as much as I could into 140 characters.

    @MMFlint @KeithOlbermann Shaming accusers, suppressing rape cases ALLOWS PEOPLE TO RAPE AND GET AWAY WITH IT. #Mooreandme

    (Sorry if this is double posted, my browser is having problems with the site.)

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:11 pm | Permalink
  41. Sady wrote:

    @Michelle: Jessica Valenti has a good roundup of misinformation v. accurate information, with links to papers that have reported the charges correctly, here:

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:17 pm | Permalink
  42. Bob Lamm wrote:

    One more “progressive” man who doesn’t take rape charges seriously. Alas, this is no surprise.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:26 pm | Permalink
  43. Charlotte wrote:

    I was 42 years old when I first heard a man being accused of rape and I cannot think of one “prominent” man being convicted.
    Excellent piece. PS I’m old.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:26 pm | Permalink
  44. MonkeyGirl wrote:

    I stole @Karen’s tweet. Great idea!

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:28 pm | Permalink
  45. Allison wrote:

    Nate Silver did the same thing today and tried to claim it was math. The post is essentially, “The investigation is politically motivated, so the charges must be fake. It’s Bayesian inference!” Barf.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:33 pm | Permalink
  46. Devin wrote:

    Anybody think, even for a second, that if Julian Assange wasn’t Julian Assange, this case would be prosecuted with even one percent of the effort and vigor it’s getting?

    That’s the bit that makes me sad.

    We SHOULD treat rape allegations this seriously. That would be justice. Sadly, we don’t, which tells me that the urgency here comes from something besides justice.

    I hope there’s justice in the trial. I really do. If this case gets slammed through because of US arm-twisting, that says “Rape is one of the privileges of power, it’s okay as long as you don’t piss off anyone bigger than you.”

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:47 pm | Permalink
  47. Kerry D wrote:

    Thank you, Sady. It’s refreshing to see someone taking Assange (and Moore, and Olbermann) to task after having heard people praise the man to the heavens and dismiss the accusations from his victims. Rape is never okay, no matter who did it.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:47 pm | Permalink
  48. Lucy wrote:

    @Allison: I liked that analysis until about halfway through, and then he lost me.
    And he, like basically everyone else on the internet, is getting distracted by analyzing whether he did it or not, which nobody knows except him and the alleged victims. What is up for public debate is whether or not his alleged actions constitute rape, which they do. Conflating those two things is bad journalism and bad science.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:48 pm | Permalink
  49. B. wrote:

    Whoa, Allison, that’s an appallingly bad article. I’ve been disappointed with Nate Silver for a while now, but this elevates him into megadouche territory.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:50 pm | Permalink
  50. JfC wrote:

    Trending in a couple places! But here come the Privilege Denying Dudes in a late entry to the race.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:51 pm | Permalink
  51. Britt wrote:

    I was both calmed and empowered with rage by this post. Thank you for putting into words what I couldn’t through angry tears of confusion and mistrust.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 4:58 pm | Permalink
  52. Jay wrote:

    Just a note about the statistics–most rapists commit multiple rapes, so the number of rapes is not the same as the number of rapists. 6% of rapes result in prison time, but that doesn’t mean that it’s just 6% of rapists put behind bars.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:05 pm | Permalink
  53. Sweet friggin thank you.

    I am so, so, so angry about the people who are saying that it demeans women to…what? Pursue rape charges? So angry to see that shit on my Facebook wall.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:08 pm | Permalink
  54. Vertigo wrote:

    Excellent post, Sady, as always.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:09 pm | Permalink
  55. A. wrote:

    Thanks for this, Sady.

    Have also been raped while sleeping by a progressive man

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:16 pm | Permalink
  56. Nikki wrote:

    This is one of the things that enrages me so much these days: progressives, liberals, socialists, humanists, LITERARY STUDENTS who flat out state: ‘Oh you, don’t believe the press you silly girl, don’t you see, you’re being manipulated! Just wake up and realize you’re just a sheep following the crowd.’
    To which I say nothing, out of complete bafflement and projectionary shame.

    Thank you for this post.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:22 pm | Permalink
  57. of making many books wrote:

    The link at the very top of the article actually says that 60% of rapes are *not* reported. …That means only 40% are! …Which is even worse than 60%!

    WhatI’mreallytryintosayis, thank you for doing what you are doing.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:24 pm | Permalink
  58. NomadiCat wrote:

    Twitter strategy sidebar:

    How convenient that #femalesneedto has been trending so hot over on Twitter for the past week or so. Anyone want to join in co-opting that irritating sexist trending topic (with such recent gems as “#femalesneedto act more like ladies and less like hoes”) and trying to get #Mooreandme a bit more visibility?

    I’m starting with “@MMFlint: #femalesneedto kick your inconsistent ass to the curb. #Mooreandme” but I’m hoping to get more elaborate as the mulled cider kicks in.

    Now if I could just figure out how to incorporate “National Cupcake” and “Scarlett Johansson”…

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:28 pm | Permalink
  59. Benjamin Ady wrote:

    Thanks for saying important things!

    In your first paragraph, you misquote the stats you reference. It’s 40% of rapes are reported, not 60%. Just a typo, but at first it put me off because it makes the 6% at the end of the paragraph mathematically incorrect =). You may want to fix that. =) For folks like me, when I see incorrect numbers it makes me less open to everything else being said, and what you are saying *is* imporant.



    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:30 pm | Permalink
  60. Adrenalin Tim wrote:

    According to RAINN, about 60% of rapes are reported

    The link you provided says that 60% of rapes are un-reported. That makes the maths work out better. Just thought you should know.

    Thanks for the article.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:34 pm | Permalink
  61. Sady wrote:

    @Adrenalin Tim: BLAGH. That’s what I get for putting up a first draft! Typo fixed now.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:35 pm | Permalink
  62. mrm0683 wrote:

    I am confused. The article that I read through the link provided said both women had sex with him willingly, they were concerned about no condom/broken condom and STDs?

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:39 pm | Permalink
  63. Sady wrote:

    @mrm0683: That article presented inaccurate information. There were a lot that did, when the case first broke (or, broke again) earlier this month. However, you’ll find links above that provide more accurate descriptions of the charges against Assange.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:50 pm | Permalink
  64. Peacerine wrote:

    WOW! Hands down! Absolutely BRILLIANT post! Thank you for sharing this!

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:52 pm | Permalink
  65. Elise wrote:

    And now I have a Twitter account. Maybe we should harness feminists together like this for more issues? I can only imagine how much more attention we could get to issues like IVAWA and . . . any number of issues, really.

    Thanks for the post, Sady.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 5:58 pm | Permalink
  66. Bee wrote:

    My first tweet in over a year! This is an excellent post, and it’s something everyone needs to read.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 6:01 pm | Permalink
  67. AS wrote:

    I already twitted him yesterday (without the hashtag obviously) when he cheered that JA was released on bail (before the release was delayed): “@MMFlint he was arrested for suspicion of sex crimes. Would you cheer for any other rape suspect’s release?”

    I am a progressive and a man and I was extremely offended by his behavior.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 6:15 pm | Permalink
  68. Kal wrote:

    “never, ever believe the “official story.”” is not the same thing as “Never, ever believe the women who are accusing Assange of rape.”

    I don’t know what Moore said on Olbermann. But you’re reading a lot more into his words above than is there. “Don’t just accept what you’re hearing” is not the same thing as “these women are lying sluts.”

    A lot of “progressives” – not only men, eg Naomi Wolf – have been revealed as having fucked-up attitudes about rape by the Assange case. The dismissal of the charges as somehow trivial is totally indefensible – if Assange is guilty of what he’s being charged with, he deserves jail.

    But at the same time, in 99.999% of rape accusations, there’s essentially no reason to think the woman is lying and every reason to think the man is. I mean, what, did someone hand her $1000000 in unmarked bills to ruin his life, or threaten to disappear her into a secret prison in Eastern Europe? That’s actually not out of the realm of possibility here; there really is a global conspiracy (aka the US national security state) working against Assange. And, there’s no reason for the accused rapist to expect a court biased against him – very much the opposite. Again, in this very rare case, it’s not crazy to think that even if Assange turns out to be innocent, he’ll spend the rest of his life in jail.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 6:33 pm | Permalink
  69. Adrenalin Tim wrote:

    Thanks for the fix, Sady. Sorry to niggle, but you only half-fixed it.

    60% of rapes aren’t reported. In those cases, there’s about a 51% chance that the 60% of reported rapes

    That’d be the 40% of reported rapes.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 6:37 pm | Permalink
  70. eastsidekate wrote:


    That Times piece is absolutely appalling.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 6:54 pm | Permalink
  71. Sady wrote:

    @Adrenalin Tim: Again, my only comment is “BLAGH.” And “curse you, lack of coffee!” Thanks for pointing it out! See, what I like to do is, I like to admit it when I screw something up. Unlike a certain Twittering documentarian we know.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 7:10 pm | Permalink
  72. Ariel wrote:

    Wonderful post. Thank you so much.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 7:14 pm | Permalink
  73. Gnatalby wrote:

    There is ALWAYS a reason not to believe a rape victim. I have never heard everyone reach a consensus that a given victim was raped either in my personal circle of friends or in the public sphere. Even when the dude has *confessed* (like the “did she bounce” case discussed here once, so long ago, in a Tiger Beatdown) people still have doubts.

    I agree Michael Moore: don’t ever believe the official story. The official story is that the man is never a rapist.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 7:25 pm | Permalink
  74. You can also see him laughing about the rape allegations on the BBC yesterday here:

    Disgusting, horrifying. We need our own revolution, not let by stupid white men.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 7:53 pm | Permalink
  75. Katrina wrote:

    Thank you for posting this. Disturbing how many people share Moore’s views.

    I joined the twitter chorus in support, and got a reply from (twitter user) @ray_peterson saying Assange had not been accused of anything defined as “rape” in the US. I replied that having sex with an unconscious woman is rape, in the US. His response? “Have some hot chocolate, take your meds, have a nap.”

    So, sisters: post in support of victims of sexual violence, and discover the men on twitter who think Assange is a hero and women need to be condescended to.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 7:56 pm | Permalink
  76. Dawn. wrote:

    Thank you, thank you, thank you for this.

    It is absolutely enraging that people are constantly conflating Assange’s work with Wikileaks, the politics surrounding that work, and the fact that he’s a rape suspect. It’s like we’re twisting our ankles trying to side-step the reality that THOSE THINGS ARE NOT RELATED, and that TWO WOMEN MAY HAVE BEEN RAPED and are DEFINITELY BEING TERRORIZED and that KINDA FUCKING MATTERS.

    Even if their accusations are false (which, considering that the FBI recently reported that only about 9% of rape accusations that are pursued turn out to be false, is unlikely), they should still be treated seriously and fairly until they are proven one way or the other.

    Also, their identities MOST DEFINITELY shouldn’t have been released. That is just baffling. The vitriol being lobbied at those women is deplorable. It’s like progressive/liberal/Democratic men are seizing the opportunity to bash women with a disturbingly sincere gusto.

    Which brings me to my point: Michael Moore, what the fuck is wrong with you????

    I am so goddamn sick of how terrifying it can be to be a woman, and how everyone around us (even some of us) try so hard to pretend everything’s okay. Only a profoundly skewed society would produce and perpetuate the kind of rape culture we’re living in. We all live in it, to varying degrees. It’s maddening to the point that it’s surreal.

    (Sorry I wrote a novella. If you didn’t notice I’m kinda pissed, haha.)

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 8:06 pm | Permalink
  77. orlando wrote:

    I really needed to hear this, thanks.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 8:22 pm | Permalink
  78. Jenny wrote:

    Should they be shipping him the U.S. though if the charges are held in Sweden?:

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 8:24 pm | Permalink
  79. Sir wrote:

    Wonderful post! Thank you.

    Julian Assange, the supposed Champion of Truth ™, is using politics to hide his own misdeeds. Governments are using rape accusations to win a stupid game of cat and mouse. Nobody is a good guy.

    All of this political manoeuvring is only hurting the victims. Rape is not a political tool; I resent the government bodies involved and the accused and his minions for using rape to further some political agenda.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 8:30 pm | Permalink
  80. Jenny wrote:

    Also, they haven’t filed any charges yet unless I’m wrong about that.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 8:34 pm | Permalink
  81. RM wrote:

    Thank you so much for this.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 8:49 pm | Permalink
  82. SMadin wrote:

    Sady, you are a badass. I’ve been anti-Twitter, but I may have to change my mind.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 9:11 pm | Permalink
  83. the rejectionist wrote:

    GO SADY. So awesome. Thank you.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 10:23 pm | Permalink
  84. GallingGalla wrote:

    I am not at all surprised that Moore and Olbermann engaged in such horrendous victim-shaming.

    I’ve just created a twitter account and posted my thoughts and objections.

    Thank you so much for organizing this, Sady.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 11:03 pm | Permalink
  85. Emmy wrote:

    This was my tweet:

    @MMFlint I’m all for openness and transparency but shutting down and dismissing rape accusations does neither. Please reconsider #mooreandme

    Hard to convey what I really wanted to say in 140 characters, but thankfully TBD is there to spell it out! Hopefully some sort of response will come out of this.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 11:27 pm | Permalink
  86. Emma wrote:

    Sady, I’ve been busily tweeting all day, at both Michael and Keith (I’m usually a big fan of his, but we’re going through a really rough patch right now thanks to this and some other things…), and sadly they’ve not responded yet, although Keith got into a debate with one of my friends JUST BEFORE HE WENT ON AIR. Literally, he just left at one point TO GO DO HIS LIVE SHOW. I don’t even.

    Anyway, he didn’t talk about any of this tonight, though I wish he had, and you know what would be awesome? If they invited you on there. Countdown suffers from a general lack of female voices most of the time. It’d be so cool to see you there. I mean, it might not happen, but I can dream, can’t I? :) Keep on keepin’ on.

    Wednesday, December 15, 2010 at 11:31 pm | Permalink
  87. julia wrote:

    I share most of the above opinions. Dissing MM seems short-term. As a long-term solution, can we get our various justice systems to begin prosecuting rape in the same way that they might prosecute robbery, assault, or other personal crimes? How?

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 12:20 am | Permalink
  88. Wednesday wrote:

    I come back from a day outside to find this on Twitter. Extremely disgusted now, though too spoonless to do much more than curl up and sob.

    Fauxgressive is an awesome word.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 12:51 am | Permalink
  89. Jen wrote:

    Dear Michael Moore,
    Thank you for making me feel shame for something that happened to me years ago. more so, thank you for making me feel ashamed that I ever thought you were a decent human being.
    No love, Me

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 1:17 am | Permalink
  90. Wednesday wrote:

    I am charmed by Olbermann’s dismissal of the hashtag, now.

    I was raped in my sleep, too. Love to everyone, and spoons if you need them, and hugs if they’re welcome.


    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 1:25 am | Permalink
  91. Anna wrote:

    Sady, here’s a direct link to the tweet where Olbermann links to the post that names one of the accusers: [EDITED.] I know you said on twitter that you can’t see it anymore.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 1:29 am | Permalink
  92. Sady wrote:

    @Anna: Thanks so much! I’m going to try to get the screencap of the “This user has protected their Tweets” screen shot converted to a GIF or JPEG from TIFF, so I can post this blog, and I’d also love to post a photo of the tweet you linked, but since right now it contains an active link to an article naming a rape accuser (which we don’t do here), I want to see if someone can blur or block out the link itself. I just want to be clear on what we’re objecting to, without further leaking the information that endangers the accuser.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 1:34 am | Permalink
  93. Sam wrote:

    @MMFlint Rape is not a tool to push agendas. Shutting down and dismissing rape allegations is not activism, it’s misogyny. #Mooreandme

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 1:39 am | Permalink
  94. PatientC wrote:

    Olbermann just responded, here are the tweets (since I think he blocked you?):

    (1/5) Rape has touched my family, directly and savagely, and if anybody thinks I have addressed it without full sensitivity, then that…

    (2/5) …assessment is the one that counts, and I apologize. But these accusations that I “revealed” an accuser’s identity by retweeting

    (3/5) Bianca Jagger’s link, or that I ‘shamed’ an accuser by asking a question about the prosecution of a man governments are

    (4/5) trying to bury, or that I do not ‘understand’ charges that have yet to be presented in their final form, reflect exactly the

    (5/5) the kind of rushing to judgment of which I’m accused, and merit the same kind of apology I have just given.

    And the direct links:

    Anyway, I was going to post a “thank you for doing this” comment, but then this popped up.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 1:56 am | Permalink
  95. Anna wrote:

    Ack, sorry Sady! I assumed the comment would be held in moderation because it included a link. /o\

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 1:57 am | Permalink
  96. Lisbeth wrote:

    @Devin – yes, actually, but we wouldn’t be hearing so damn much about it. The Swedish justice system is not perfect when it comes to dealing with rape cases but it’s certainly better than many others. I mean, I’ve read a good chunk of the depressing books and articles about how the Swedish justice system fails despite its proclaimed progressiveness, and I can still believe that extradition would be requested in a case like this with a less well-known suspect.

    Which is not to say that the huge public shitstorm that this thing is now won’t have an impact on the course of justice one way or another.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 3:26 am | Permalink
  97. Craig Ranapia wrote:

    I got a simply bizarre Tweet from Olbermann demanding that I(and I quote) “retract” calling his a rape apologist.

    I’m now happy to oblige. “Obtuse, mendacious douche-bag who’s acting like he’s auditioning for Fox News” does the job just as well.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 6:07 am | Permalink
  98. CassieC wrote:

    @Katrina on 74: That guy wasn’t just condescending to you. He was threatening to rape you (“take a nap” … implied so someone can do to you what J. Assange is accused of doing).

    Because the strongest argument against the accusation of being dismissive of rape is to threaten someone with rape. And no, it’s not “just a joke”: it’s a way of bullying people and perpetuating the rape culture.

    Anyway, Katrina, run like hell if you ever meet this guy in real life.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 6:12 am | Permalink
  99. FRANK wrote:

    I think perfectly justified emotion is clouding people’s commentary on this matter here and elsewhere and I’d like to make some simple points for the sake of continued discussion.

    - Assange may be innocent of the charges against him.
    - Rape charges are made falsely at times, unfortunately.
    - We must assume innocence until guilt has been proven for everyone’s sake, male or female.
    - Thus we have to be careful not to prematurely condemn Assange for rape until a court of law has dealt with the charges.
    - Rape claims must be taken seriously and investigated regardless of the character of the accusers or current circumstances of the alleged perpetrator.
    - More rape claims should be reported and investigated than are currently.
    - Even without statistics stating the same, it is reasonable to assume that the number of successful prosecutions for rape is very far behind the number of cases where rape has actually occurred.
    - The false reporting of rape does not imply other rape claims must be taken less seriously.
    - Not all male progressives are claiming the rape charges against Assange are false. Do not paint them all with the same brush.
    - Moore is doing a disservice to his causes and supporters and especially to Assange’s accusers by discounting their claims of rape based upon my next point:
    - Assange’s arrest on rape charges and the manhunt for him could very well have been accelerated and expedited by the exertion of political pressure from people upset at Assange’s involvement with WikiLeaks. It is sadly like the instances when police look for the slightest traffic infractions to bring in and hold suspects that they cannot yet bring in on larger charges. This time however, there are highly placed people who care little for the accusers of Assange for rape but for the chance to imprison him for any reason.

    That is what would have been more constructive of Moore to state. In light of the difficulty of women achieving prosecution against their rapists, Moore should have chosen his words much more carefully lest he add to the problem of claims of rape not being investigated adequately.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 6:44 am | Permalink
  100. Sady wrote:

    @Frank: That’s reasonable. I hope you don’t think that you’re the first person to make all of these points simultaneously, though? Lots of women have already made them, such as Jessica Valenti, Jill Filipovic, and Anna North. This sounds an awful lot like, “ladies, ladies, let a MAN explain this to you,” especially when you open with a claim that you and you alone are able to look at these things without “emotion.”

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 7:00 am | Permalink
  101. Sady wrote:

    @Suzanne,*: WE. DON’T. PUBLISH. OR LINK TO. MATERIAL. CONTAINING. ACCUSERS’. NAMES. Got it? Your “open, neutral, considered” debate can happen as soon as you stop endangering those women.

    *See what I did there? I left in enough info for YOU to identify YOURSELF, but I didn’t throw your contact info to the wolves. Because I respect you as a human being — though not so much as a blog commenter! — enough to do that.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 7:04 am | Permalink
  102. FRANK wrote:

    No, I wasn’t assuming I was originating those thoughts or being the only one making them. (Just doing my part to save the world by restating the obvious in times of peril!)
    I certainly did not mean to unduly ascribe emotionality to yourself or solely your female respondents. Please, please don’t assume that I would do so. (I have feelings too! Heh.)Nor did I mean to imply I was solely capable of any constructive detachment.
    I merely think it serves text-only discussion/debate over the web by having intermittent summations rather than allowing tangential debates to derail the developments you have so rightly called attention to. (Which is also not meant to discount your ability to moderate any replies you receive.) The kind of reaction you had to what I wrote at the start and how others were interacting on this issue is exactly why I thought so many simple points needed to be made. (I certainly won’t be offended if you see no need to add this followup to the page… it’s effectively off topic.)

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 7:25 am | Permalink
  103. Oline4444 wrote:

    Bravo, speak up!

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 7:47 am | Permalink
  104. tinfoil hattie wrote:

    Sady, thank you for this post, which made me feel like crying with relief.

    Frank 103, you’re still mansplaining. Please shut up. Please stop with the sage “Alas, women do make false rape allegations, sadly” comment (your second point – after – “now, now, Assange may be innocent) in a long, patronizing list of Why The Ladies Need To Think About These Important Things Before They Claim That The World Is Largely One Big Cesspool of Rape Apologia. Go back and READ. THE. POST. for the FACTS about rape, reported rape, prosecution, and conviction of rape. Then just keep quiet.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 9:31 am | Permalink
  105. Shelley wrote:

    I have experience in criminal justice. Sure, there are false accusations of rape. However,it is extremely difficult to prove a rape case, and for it to have come to the point that he had charges filed there has to be evidence.
    I’ve always admired his willingness to stand against bullying and hypocrisy…and now I feel he is guilty of both of those. :-(

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 10:09 am | Permalink
  106. CJ wrote:

    Thank you for this post, Sady.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 10:14 am | Permalink
  107. VJ wrote:

    I just closed my twitter account, but I am opening a new one for this. My mom and my formerly Republican blue-collar dad LOVE Micheal Moore. I am livid he is so conditional in his morals. Great post Sady.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 11:44 am | Permalink
  108. spiralsheep wrote:

    Kate Harding posted an excellent and detailed takedown of the misogynist bullshit, with links to the known facts:

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 11:47 am | Permalink
  109. teresa wrote:

    Yes… I quit watching everyone on MSNBC after that little anti-woman BS they put out there. And yes I want to take them down as the face of the left, because those zealots don’t represent me, and they never will. I am so pissed about this…..
    Great post Sady, great post and spot on.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 1:12 pm | Permalink
  110. N'Awlins Contrarian wrote:

    re: “If we factor in the rapes that go unreported, only 6% of rapists ever serve time. EVER.”

    I SUSPECT that what the stats you’re quoting, assuming they are correct, actually mean is that, for any particular rape, the chance of the rapist spending time in prison FOR THAT RAPE is 6%. The important point here is that most serious crimes are committed by people who commit more than one crime, so every victim who can work through the system and put a criminal in jail (it can take a lot of courage, strength, patience, and persistence) is probably sending to jail somebody who has actually committed several crimes, and whose being in jail may very well prevent the commission of additional future crimes.

    Also, it should have been fairly evident a long time ago what an unfair, worthless, biased, a$$h01e Michael Moore is–even if SOME of his targets may be worthy targets.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 4:00 pm | Permalink
  111. Rossa wrote:

    Mine: @MMFlint: #frequentlyaskedquestions Why is Michael Moore being a rape apoligizing douche?Progressive my arse. #Mooreandme

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 4:05 pm | Permalink
  112. Steev wrote:

    Thanks for this great post, an important contribution to this debate, a debate that seems in many cases to have turned many friends into enemies and new battle lines to be drawn.

    I think Assange should be investigated and punished for anything wrong he’s done to these women. And yet I do worry that being in custody or in a Swedish prison will make it easier for his enemies (the U.S. government) to go after him for espionage or whatever other crazy charges they make up to punish him for Wikileaks. But this doesn’t absolve him from any wrongdoings to these 2 women.

    I’m just glad that Wikileaks apparently is bigger than just Assange, and if he gets jailed or assassinated, the institution he has set up will continue to do its important work, even if its founder is, sadly, a rapist.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 4:48 pm | Permalink
  113. tirannie wrote:

    @MMFlint Rape needs to be taken seriously, even when the accused is a sacred cow of progressivism. We all expect better from you #mooreandme

    It grosses me out that he calls it all hooey and laughs about it. Grrr.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 5:20 pm | Permalink
  114. mike wrote:

    I’m a Republican and I don’t see this as a progressive / conservative issue its a decency issue and Mr. Moore has none.


    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 5:22 pm | Permalink
  115. EJ wrote:

    To share my story, sadly, my rapist admitted to doing it but since the investigating officer messed up his facts in his summary to the DA . . . he got off on a technicality. Blood, sweat and tears went into getting this person in jail and our country lets another – ADMITTED – rapist on the loose.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 5:28 pm | Permalink
  116. DOZ HEWSON wrote:

    I’m A MAN.
    I’m BLACK.
    I’m 42 AGEYEARS.
    I’m FAT.
    I’ve NO PARTY.
    I know myself as a LIBERATION LIBERTARIAN.
    I don’t do TWITTER.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 7:14 pm | Permalink
  117. JK wrote:

    I am not a progressive. I am not a conservative. I’m an independent who hangs around in the center cause I think leaning too far in any direction means eventually you tip over.
    But most importantly, I am a father of 2 daughters. So, I will ask Mr. Moore this- If my daughter was accusing a darling of the left of rape, would it be dismissed as “hooey” if you liked his politics and not hers? Rape has no political affiliation or slant. It’s just an atrocity.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 7:49 pm | Permalink
  118. Dr. Braverman Free wrote:

    Dr. Lewis E. Braverman, a Harvard trained endocrinologist, engaged in indecent A&B of the breasts of all of his female patients while he was working at UMass Medical Center in Worcester, MA. Multiple doctors observed the assaults, yet no one stopped him even after patients complained.

    No one has investigated the 15K to 40K assaults or contained him.

    Women are fodder.

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 7:55 pm | Permalink
  119. Lou wrote:

    Thank you so much for this post! I’ve been in massive feminist rage about this ever since some idiot guy called me a FASCIST for daring to suggest that hey, guess what maybe Assange did commit rape, we can’t just write off the claims of those women because he’s a powerful man. After my blind rage abated I began looking about for intelligent commentary on this, and here you are. :)

    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 8:35 pm | Permalink
  120. Kathleen wrote:

    Hey, you know what feels really good in this feel-bad scenario? donating to the defense of Bradley Manning (Glenn Greenwald has a link at Salon).

    Somehow the plight of the alleged leaker kid actually living in 23 hour a day solitary hasn’t raised quite the same enraged empathy among Progressive Manpeople as the plight of the beleagured alleged rapist.

    (though Ida thunk the courage to leak is sort of at the heart of Wikileaks)

    Could it be because one is a gay fella and the other is a het sexxee (possibly forcible) sexytimes fella?


    Thursday, December 16, 2010 at 9:34 pm | Permalink
  121. Kathleen wrote:

    Balzac — ? Australian journalists are adorbs like baby red pandas or sumpin? I don’t follow.

    Friday, December 17, 2010 at 12:16 am | Permalink
  122. smadin wrote:

    Kathleen, judging from Balzac’s comments on the other #MooreandMe thread, he’s not really here to engage in serious discussion, so I wouldn’t hold my breath for a cogent response.

    Friday, December 17, 2010 at 12:32 am | Permalink
  123. Sady wrote:

    @Smadin, @Kathleen: Balzac, or apparently “Paul Gaskin,”, apparently got past our comment screening somehow. His IP address has been banned. Sorry for the intentional, trolling disruption.

    Friday, December 17, 2010 at 12:37 am | Permalink
  124. Kathleen wrote:

    Smadin — oh, okay. Thanks for the heads up!

    Friday, December 17, 2010 at 12:37 am | Permalink
  125. smadin wrote:

    I did think “circle-jerk for women who hate men” was pretty classic, though.

    Friday, December 17, 2010 at 12:38 am | Permalink
  126. Alecto wrote:

    I was raped in my sleep as well, by a progressive man.
    I didn’t report it, because I didn’t want to face police disbelief, or flat-out being turned away from the police station, being ostracised from my circle of friends – the first person I told, straight after, didn’t believe me – and I just took advantage of the fact that I was changing countries anyway to cut off all ties.
    All this is making me want to throw up. I didn’t want to go through it myself – I find it inconceivable that anyone would put themselves through this kind of shit multiplied by a billion since the man you’re accusing is a progressive hero with worldwide supporters.
    Yeah, those two women are really going to benefit from accusing him.
    I used to be fond of Michael Moore as well. Those days are definitely over
    Thanks Sady.

    Friday, December 17, 2010 at 4:11 am | Permalink
  127. k not k wrote:

    Thank you Sady.

    Friday, December 17, 2010 at 9:37 am | Permalink
  128. Kathleen wrote:

    smadin — ha ha ha ha ha hah ah. I am sorry to have missed that antic.

    Friday, December 17, 2010 at 9:45 am | Permalink
  129. Wikileaks is good wrote:

    Take care, Assange’s defenders are actively hacking anyone’s account information who posts a defense of the women involved, by tracking back to their e-mail account information. I posted a response on the Independent sympathetic to the woman’s perspective and that the facts needed to be investigated. I got several nasty posts back attacking me as a dup and worse. Within 24 hours my e-mail was hacked and my accounts accessed. These rape apologists are OUT OF CONTROL.

    Just a couple obvious points. If Assange had responded to the womens original requests for STD test, this would not have blown up in his face. He refused to communicate with them – if it walks and quacks like a duck – maybe he is just a rapist…

    Assange raised thousands to defend Pfc. Bradley Manning, and has given his defense team 0$ Can we all post or tweet Oberfool and Moore – WHERE’s THE MONEY??? afterall – Manning is the TRUE Hero here!!!

    Friday, December 17, 2010 at 10:42 am | Permalink
  130. Lora wrote:

    It infuriates me that the self-aggrandizing Assange insists that his progressivist agenda precludes his eligibility for prosecution for sex crimes. Because being famous is a justification? Is Mr. WikiLeaks Hero starting to remind anyone else of Kobe Bryant?

    Friday, December 17, 2010 at 12:28 pm | Permalink
  131. Wikileaks is good wrote:

    @ Lora, wasnt this the Polanski defense? He is just such a good director and he does movies about liberal issues… And we all know the evil USA court system is corrupt and all…

    When Polanski happened last year, all my liberal friends had the same Saint Assnage excuses…
    She looked older than 13
    She dress sexy (asking for it i guess)
    Her Mom was a gold digger
    Two psycologists said he was ok!
    The Judge was corrupt because he didnt accept ple bargin
    The DA agreed to reduce sentence to time served

    The last two were great. Just because the DA recommends a plea bargin, doesnt mean the Judge has to accept. The Liberals used the Judges non-acceptance to show the whole process was tainted against Polanski – watch the HBO special. Just like this case, they avoid talking about the facts or allow the facts to be explored, and delve into flights of paranoid fantasy – so with Assange, it will be a CIA honeypot operation, which they will all believe with absolutelty no proof.

    Friday, December 17, 2010 at 12:37 pm | Permalink
  132. tinfoil hattie wrote:

    I’m sorry, Alecto. I’m so very sorry. This must be horrible for you.

    Friday, December 17, 2010 at 3:03 pm | Permalink
  133. Julia wrote:

    troll alert.

    Sunday, December 19, 2010 at 3:10 pm | Permalink
  134. mb wrote:

    Hi Sady, just want to tell you that you’re amazing. :)

    Sunday, December 19, 2010 at 3:16 pm | Permalink
  135. Garland wrote:

    @134: Thank you, Julia. I assume you were referring to the now deleted comment that was using a survivor’s testimony to concern troll? From the person who is no longer welcome to comment on this site? Because they are a terrible, terrible human being?

    Sunday, December 19, 2010 at 3:57 pm | Permalink
  136. Julia wrote:

    @136/Garland: Yes. It was almost unintelligible but it pinged off my Troll Alert system. Thank you!

    Monday, December 20, 2010 at 11:23 am | Permalink
  137. Pirate Jenny wrote:

    I just want to join the chorus of thanks. I survived rape but did not report it because I was convinced by his friends (and even a few of mine) that I would not be believed. I was very young and still developing my political beliefs but I considered myself a feminist and a staunch supporter of people who had been sexually assaulted. Still, I could not bring myself to report. This is the insidious nature of rape apology / victim blaming and it needs to stop. What Julian Assange accomplished with WikiLeaks and the why and how of his prosecution are SEPARATE ISSUES from the dismissive, at times hostile attitude towards the women he is accused of raping and attitudes about the importance of rape (and by extrapolation, women) in general.

    Tuesday, December 21, 2010 at 1:30 am | Permalink
  138. Erin wrote:

    I just want you to know that what I think you are doing is fucking awesome and that I think you are so brave. And passionate. And incredibly dedicated. As a young feminist, you inspire me. Stay strong, Sady! Much love. Will be tweeting.

    Tuesday, December 21, 2010 at 3:25 am | Permalink
  139. Ashley wrote:

    Thank you so much for being the first person to talk about this rationally, and hold that horrible guy accountable for what he’s accused of.

    P.S. Just because the second woman seemed interested in Assange before she met him does not make her 1) a “stalker,” 2) obsessive, or 3) in any way RESPONSIBLE for any actions Assange may have taken towards her. Just more victim-blaming.

    I need to find the link, but some reporter uncovered some long-form ramblings Assange posted online about five years ago … he goes on about women and how “they just want someone to stand up to their father.” He treats women in an extremely shallow and harmful way. Personally, even through the victim-blaming narratives out there in the mainstream press, I can 100% see how this guy (it’s always the arrogant/powerful ones) did exactly what they are saying he did.

    Thanks again for writing this.

    Tuesday, December 21, 2010 at 5:23 am | Permalink
  140. I wanted to thank you for this great read!! I definitely enjoying every little bit of it I have you bookmarked to check out new stuff you post.

    Wednesday, December 22, 2010 at 4:27 pm | Permalink
  141. Patrick wrote:

    Well done. In their ” zeal ” to do anything anti-american government, these guys sometimes overlook the delicate issues in front of their faces. Glad you took them to task.

    Monday, December 27, 2010 at 9:04 am | Permalink
  142. Meg wrote:

    Stepping into the fray a little late on this one I guess, but WOW. Sady, your post was amazing and has inspired me to call out anyone I know who starts spouting any of this rape apologist BULLSHIT, whether it’s about Assange or any other case. Now excuse me, I need to go create a twitter account and ritualistically burn some Michael Moore DVDs.

    Tuesday, December 28, 2010 at 7:22 am | Permalink
  143. Fury Telford wrote:

    Sady, you’ll be copping a lot of flack for this, but damn fucking skippy to you.

    There has been a lot of talk where I am about this case and almost all the women (middle aged) are saying these girls are just complaining because he slept with more than one of them.

    I commend you in sticking your neck out and saying what needs to be said. This is such an important issue that everyone is for in theory and no one is for in practice.

    Tuesday, January 11, 2011 at 6:15 am | Permalink